Does anybody know precisely how the cooling efficiency in Smurfy works? I know it's supposed to be (heat dissipated per second) / (heat generated per second) but there is some small factor that I am missing in there. Anybody know what this factor is? If you calculate your own heat efficiencies by hand (with an engine in there - very important) your numbers won't match up. I'm trying to calculate my own cooling efficiencies with quirks so this would be helpful. Sure, I can get in the ballpark which would be perfectly acceptable, but... I NEED TO KNOW!
If I am not mistaken, Smurfy takes into account moving penalties. (But not Jump Jet penalties.) The two 'Mechs I have mathed up so far comes really close to his numbers, so it's hard to say if I am a little off. The moving penalty, if I read correctly is a reduction in the number of heatsinks being used for dissipation. At top speed, the mech uses two less heat sinks. So if you average the heat dissipation (remembering that only the internal heat sinks count as 2.0 with doubles. Even if you are able to store more in the engine... Otherwise they are 1.4 (Dissipates .2 and .14 HPS respectively) of a stationary mech and a mech moving at top speed, *then* divide by Heat Per Second, you should be pretty spot-on. Though some of them don't seem to be adding up right... I'll give examples from a couple of different builds from the site (Sans Quirks, those will affect the formula): My favorite FS9-A build - FS9-A "Micro Psycho" Smurfy's offers a heat efficiency of 38% (Unquirked) Stationary, this 'Mech dissipates 2.42 heat per second (Remember, the extra heat sink in the engine still only counts for .14 HDS), moving full speed, it dissipates 2.02 heat per second of (It takes out two of the most efficient sinks, maybe only for jumpers?)- averaging out to 2.22 heat dissipated per second. All dem Pulses generate 5.84 heat per second. Our math then tells us, that 2.22/ 5.84 is 38% Edit: (Okay, so it dropped out my analysis of the CDA-2B and the link to the Hellfire as I was editing. Bah. not reposting. Summary - If I remove one efficient and one non-efficient sink (Because it isn't a jumper) the math worked out fine for the CDA-2B and matched Smurfy's.) Firebrand "Hellfire" Stationary = 2 Moving = 1.6 Average = 1.8 Heat Gen = 6.2 1.8/6.2 = .29 Hrm. 2% less than Smurfy's 31%... Okay, no sinks outside the engine. Hrm... Okay, last one... BLR-1D "Dragon Roar" Stationary = 2.42 Moving = 2.02 Average = 2.22 Heat Gen = 5.21 2.22/5.21 = .43, also off from Smurfy's 45%... Hrm... Not going to put the math here, but even this ends up being off if I remove one efficient and one non-efficient sink. Okay, my math seems to not match up. I think I am off on something. But close? Time to ponder more.
Actually, looks like flawed HPS values for the MLAs and LLAs (at least). What he reports for their HPS values is not what he uses for their cooling efficiency calculations.
It's (sustainable DPS) / (max DPS), without perks unlocked (you can see it with perks unlocked in the weaponlab tab). Movement heat is not not taken in account (it's heat neutral), and it also doesn't count JJs.
Okay, does anybody know how sustainable dps is calculated? I have to believe that it is something, like, dps * cooling efficiency. If that is the case, dps just cancels out anyways. I am looking for a useful value to interpret here, and the ratio of dpses can't be it.
The sustainable DPS is the DPS you deal at neutral heat generation. But the value calculated by Smurfy's is pretty theoretical, since it considers all weapons are used evenly. Which is obviously not the case when you manage your heat. For example, this Ilya with 3 AC/5 and 2 LLas is given a sustained DPS of 4.78, but it only because it supposes the lasers are shot at a similar rate than ACs; but ACs alone are heat neutral, which means the real sustainable DPS is at least 9.03. That's one of the many reasons why two builds with the same heat efficiency may behave differently, the first being easy to manage, the second harder.
Does anyone pay attention to the Heat Efficiency in Smurfy? I just go by past experience and then look at the new quirks and build accordingly. I have builds that can fire repeatedly but allegedly have a 1.08 efficiency....
Obviously the answer is yes. It is a useful metric for starting to think about how a mech will behave in the wild.
Why is it a useful metric as it seems to have no accuracy as regards real combat? Movement alone used to skew it as light/medium pilots almost never stop moving. Quirks and modules make it totally invalid. I'm curious as I could have missed something. Edit: I see its use for a new player as it establishes the idea of a heat scale and effect of heat sinks but I think everyone learns the hard way. Coincidentally the idea that the max amount of heat you can take is also effected by the amount of heat sinks you have isn't conveyed at all though or certainly not in an obvious way.Nor is that engine heatsinks up to 250 rating are more effective.
Well, since the smurfy scale gives a ratio of generated hps to maximum hps dissipated I find it very useful as a first order approximation. Obviously you need to battle test it to see its viability but I still love it initially to see if I am in the right ballpark for a build.
Except it makes little sense now. As an example, if I fire the 2 LPL on my WVR-6K it generates almost no heat over my current heat dissipation due to the quirks. If I fire those on another medium mech it generates a lot of heat. According to Smurfy those are identical. A new player volley firing their weaponry safe in the knowledge that they've built it on Smurfy's suddenly has hideous problems as it doesn't include ghost heat and presumes you notice when they link together ersl and erml (amusingly missed by several extremely experienced players on the site according to a couple of recent threads which implies a LOT of other players missed it) etc. I've already mentioned movement and jumping problems. Don't get me wrong Smurfy's is a brilliant building tool I use almost every day but I place zero value in the heat side currently.
Well, fair enough. I cannot argue against the huge effect that quirks have upon cooling efficiency and how Smurfy's lack of incorporating these values has a negative impact upon its utility. I especially cannot fault this view as I have created my own spreadsheet to calculate the true cooling efficiencies myself for builds I am particularly interested in. So... I find the cooling efficiency stat so valuable I wanted to invest time to see what it is, but I agree that value shown in Smurfy right now is completely useless.
Yeah it's good for clans but need a revamp for IS quirks, I think they are holding off as many are most lickely to be changed. Also @epikt 's concept is correct, for example my Stalker with around 30% heat eff. but SRM, ML and LL was really cool ingame, while 30% with 4 LPL was too hot (cool now thanks to quirks). Basically with a lot of weapons 30% is ok, with less weapons you want 40%+, at least this was my way of thinking before quirks.
Smurfy is working on it though, just so you know before you invest too much time.Beware PGI tweaking the numbers in a week or more, pretty sure that will happen.
